Wood Duck - Apricot Mutation

parvo · **Joined:** Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:39 pm **Posts:** 735

Sorry guys but I've seen these birds for myself.

They are an Australian Wood duck mutation, both cocks and hens have been bred. They are not an American Wood duck (Carolina Duck) mutation.

Not only are they in captivity but birds have been seen in the wild- that's where the mutation originated. In fact there was one at a golf course on the Victorian/NSW border which was on youtube at one stage. The members were very protective of their "unusual" duck. They have also been seen in the Burpengary area in SE QLD.

I have not seen the Americans claim they have this particular mutation so they may be unfamiliar with it.
This is exactly why I have previously been a little pedantic about distinguishing between the American and Australian wood ducks because they are 2 totally different species. When you mention wood ducks to the Americans, they naturally think of their wood duck-what we call the Carolina.

Weston · **Posted:** Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:25 pm

If the "mutation" [for argument sake] originated in the wild how do they know its genetic family background? Did the parents or grand parent or great grand parents or great great grand parents ect.. ect... of the "mutation" [for argument sake] ever come in contact with domestic ducks? Also have they genetically tested it and can they provide proof of its purity?

parvo · **Joined:** Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:39 pm **Posts:** 735

Weston, I don't understand your cynicism.

The coloured birds in the wild were taken as ducklings from normal coloured parents; the siblings were also normal coloured but some were obviously split for the mutation.

These have mated with normal wood ducks and produced more coloured offspring. There are now both ducks and drakes produced.

All the birds appear to be true to type.

The adult bird on the Vic/NSW was also true to type- only the colour differed- and it was in with a flock of wood ducks- no domestics.

I have never heard of a fertile hybrid between the Australian Wood Duck and any of the domestic ducks. They belong to different genera.

Even if such hybrids were fertile, the offspring would show some very obvious signs of hybridization- eg size, shape, beak shape etc.

They are nothing more than a naturally occurring recessive mutation. The odd bird pops up in the wild but because it stands out most are probably taken before they get a chance to breed.

I have seen similarly coloured mutations occurring in the wild in kookaburras, magpies, sparrows and blackbirds to name a few.
Why not in wood ducks?

Cheers

Parvo

Weston · **Posted:** Fri Apr 26, 2013 8:58 am

How do you know all this, you seem to have intimate knowledge? Can I read all about it on a web site?

Quote:

The adult bird on the Vic/NSW was also true to type- only the colour differed- and it was in with a flock of wood ducks- no domestics.

ALL wild waterfowl flocks come in direct contact with domestic waterfowl as we all know. [how do you know there were no domestics? were you there? what was the history of that wild flock?]

Quote:

I have never heard of a fertile hybrid between the Australian Wood Duck and any of the domestic ducks. They belong to different genera.

Heres a woodie hybrid http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r3/M ... ybrid3.jpg
Does not matter if its australian or north american wood duck or in this case their genera they can and do hybridize and are fertile.

Quote:

Even if such hybrids were fertile, the offspring would show some very obvious signs of hybridization- eg size, shape, beak shape etc.

Yes the colour, with enough cross breeding back to pure woods that is all that would be obvious to the untrained eye. Also if you compare this white duck with a pure aust wood duck you can see this white duck has considerable more top skull than a pure woodie duck.

Quote:

They are nothing more than a naturally occurring recessive mutation

Can you show some genetic records of this?

The more I look into this the more I see a hybrid and I am not alone there.

Weston · **Posted:** Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:01 am

P.s as wood ducks require a licence to be kept then a permit to catch wild native ducks is needed. Is there public records of this permit?

doggo · **Posted:** Fri Apr 26, 2013 4:30 pm

Thanks for that interesting account Parvo. The emergence of novel colour forms in wild populations gives us an insight into the workings of genetics and evolution.

Do you think that this particular colour form is the result of a recent mutation or might it have been floating around in the background for many thousands of years?

ColacWaterfowl · **Posted:** Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:05 pm

Good account there Weston that crossing has been going on for hundreds if not thousands of years

Weston · **Posted:** Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:16 pm

I get you

I call it as I see it

parvo · **Joined:** Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:39 pm **Posts:** 735

How do you know all this, you seem to have intimate knowledge? Can I read all about it on a web site?

Not everything is on the internet Weston;

ALL wild waterfowl flocks come in direct contact with domestic waterfowl as we all know. [how do you know there were no domestics? were you there? what was the history of that wild flock?]
If you watched the video you could see the flock of wood ducks on the golf course. There were no domestics hanging around. I also have an ornithologist friend who went to see the bird and he also did not see any domestics hanging around; it was also his opinion that it was a wood duck mutation.

Heres a woodie hybrid http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r3/M ... ybrid3.jpg
Does not matter if its australian or north american wood duck or in this case their genera they can and do hybridize and are fertile.

You have still not shown me a photo of a hybrid Australian Wood Duck with a domestic duck.
If they existed they would be found more commonly as wood ducks are so common around farms and waterways where domestic ducks exist. If they were fertile, then the wood ducks would be contaminated with domestic duck blood, much as the mallards have contaminated many populations of black ducks.

There is no evidence of this occurring. If you doubt me then just ask Birds Australia, the premier ornithological organisation in Australia.

Yes the colour, with enough cross breeding back to pure woods that is all that would be obvious to the untrained eye. Also if you compare this white duck with a pure aust wood duck you can see this white duck has considerable more top skull than a pure woodie duck.

Are you seriously suggesting that somebody has bothered to go to all that trouble to achieve this? The original bird was found as a duckling and is still producing offspring. There haven't been enough generations produced to achieve what you are suggesting.
Basing your comments about "top skull size" on a photo might be misleading. Why don't you ask to see the bird for yourself so you can make a first-hand judgement rather than basing your comments on a photo? If you can't get there yourself then send a mate who knows his waterfowl and who you trust.

I saw the bird as a duckling, and later at its current residence as a mature bird during an interstate aviary visit. I could ask my QLD mate who took me to the breeder's house to organise a visit for you if you want.

parvo · **Joined:** Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:39 pm **Posts:** 735

Weston wrote:

P.s as wood ducks require a licence to be kept then a permit to catch wild native ducks is needed. Is there public records of this permit?

Yes, you are spot on there.

I seriously doubt that the person who originally acquired the duckling did so legally.

By the way, Featherdale Wildlife Park have also had dilute coloured wood ducks on display, which the head keeper is certain are all pure birds.

Weston, I have no agenda with this, one way or the other. I am not into the political bickering that some want to get caught up in.

I am, however, interested in presenting the facts, not just accusatory negativity.

The mutation appears to be recessive because the original bird came from a pair of normal coloured parents- therefore it can't be dominant; I believe that breeding results to date support this but can't say if it is sex-linked or autosomal recessive because not enough test matings have been undertaken.

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