Pairings and outcomes (controlled breeding)

CinnGuinea · **Posted:** Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:44 am

What pairings have you done and what did you get from controlled breeding?
NOT FREE RANGE

FRANKLINS · **Joined:** Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:18 am **Posts:** 1

Can I just confirm that there are no females split to cinnamon please. I looked at an advert for some for sale and they say split for cinnamon but not sure if they mean both males and females and reading here and other web sites thats not possible with the females

CinnGuinea · **Posted:** Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:15 pm

Your right they don't. If someone claims the hens are split ask them to prove it bet they can't. Just try to buy split males and pair them to cinnamon hens that way you will breed them and not waste your time

GuineasofPerth · **Posted:** Thu Jan 17, 2013 6:28 pm

Hi guys its been awhile, sorry busy with work in the north west.

Ok do you guys remember this post Tue Apr 19, 2011

GuineasofPerth wrote:

I saw this and decided to add my experience with so called split to cinnamon. I purchased off the internet and paid to have them sent all the way over here so called split cinnamon guinea fowls in both males and females and was told to breed them together and I would breed some cinnamons well 2 years latter and 69 chicks latter and no cinnamons have come they are all grey and lavender. I have asked a few good breeders about why and they have all told me there is no such thing and a split to cinnamon female and unless I get a cinnamon female or a silver female I will never breed them. So I have ordered 2 cinnamon females and will then hopefully breed some. So my advice to people is beware of these claims I think some are just out for the money.

Well I decided to keep these together and see if I ever bred a cinnamon from them and yes I did 1 cinnamon keet hen. Now I also added 3 more so called split cinnamon hens all lavender to this group of ALL splits so its a sizeable flock now and ALL splits {hold the laughter}

So to answer the question on the recessive V sex linked well here is 100% proof they are not recessive. If they were recessive then hens could be split to cinnamon as can the cockbirds right!

So breeding split cinnamon to split cinnamon = 50% cinnamon offspring both sexes

Lets look at the number 50%

Now from last year to this year I have bred 184 keet from these 'so called splits' and only 1 cinnamon keet hen YES 1 only, so its cannot be recessive its not possible or I would have around 80-90

Now with sex linked I would get the odd cinnamon hen from a pairing of split cinnamon to non split hen lavender but the % is very low so this proves none of these so called split hens are actually split at all and remember ALL were guaranteed splits in both sexes yes guaranteed and the last 3 hens also came from Qld north of brisbane and guaranteed split so nether breeder have any idea what so ever.

GuineasofPerth · **Posted:** Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 am

For the record I have emailed a scan copy of my breeding book for my controlled study to a breeder in the US who has 47 years experience with guinea fowl. He has all the mutations available and all species inc vulturine guineas and he has studied genetics for more than 15 years. His reply is long and detailed so I won't post it but he has confirmed the gene is sex linked from my controlled study results. If someone out there with more than 47 years experience and who has studied genetics wants to step up and continue to claim a theory of autosomal recessive then please back it up with honest proof as no one has done that to date.

AGFBG · **Posted:** Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:27 am

AGFBG has already started a study of breeding outcomes for our book due we hope by the end of the year. GuineasofPerth is 1 of 39 breeders in the study along with genetic experts to review the results. The study in broken into 6 sections with the "Splits" being 1 section. Its to soon to give any final results but from my own experience and the interim results added to the AGFBG data base on AGFBG web site from the study group its clear the long standing understanding of cinnamon and silver being sex linked is confirmed. The final results will be published in the book along with all information on guinea fowl in australia. We are pleased that Peacocks Australia will announce the new mutations in our book along with full colour pictures.

More in the topic Guinea Fowl in Australia viewtopic.php?f=5&t=30699

JonksGuineas · **Posted:** Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:20 am

Awesome posts GuineasofPerth good to know there are proper studies being done on our guinea fowls

GuineasofPerth · **Posted:** Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:39 pm

AGFBG wrote:

AGFBG has already started a study of breeding outcomes for our book due we hope by the end of the year. GuineasofPerth is 1 of 39 breeders in the study along with genetic experts to review the results. The study in broken into 6 sections with the "Splits" being 1 section. Its to soon to give any final results but from my own experience and the interim results added to the AGFBG data base on AGFBG web site from the study group its clear the long standing understanding of cinnamon and silver being sex linked is confirmed. The final results will be published in the book along with all information on guinea fowl in australia. We are pleased that Peacocks Australia will announce the new mutations in our book along with full colour pictures.

More in the topic Guinea Fowl in Australia viewtopic.php?f=5&t=30699

So far 7 breeders have reported the same results and we reiterate if they were recessive {which they are not} then over the 7 breeders SO FAR we should see the results in favor of this silly theory but we don't ALL documented controlled breeding results show the inheritance is sex linked no question about it. The book will end the theory once and for all with the results and genetic expert findings

JonksGuineas · **Posted:** Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:09 pm

Thats because there are no split hens so impossible to be recessive

GuineasofPerth · **Posted:** Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:23 pm

Correct.

Most of the study flocks were bred direct from cinnamon pairing to lavender and cinnamon to pearl non pied. Based on the direct lineage to cinnamon the offspring must be split and if they were recessive {which they are not} then 50% of each hatchings would be split at 25% for each sex. As ALL the keets were kept together from the 6 settings then we must have split hens in the breed groups and of course split cockbirds and in good numbers. This means we should now have a good number of cinnamon bred from these study groups but no we do not. 184 keet from my study groups of these 'so called splits' and only 1 cinnamon keet hen. If they were recessive {which they are not} we would have around 80 cinnamon keets so there is no doubt the theory of recessive is just a myth.

Anyone that has had a cinnamon keet appear seemingly out of the blue will now understand why.

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