Mammoth Mallard Rouens

Weston · **Posted:** Sun Aug 04, 2013 7:55 pm

doggo wrote:

Yes I do.
The "mammoth mallard" proponents clearly do not understand the genetics of the mallard derived domestic ducks. They are all the same species. They are all mallards. They have all been developed by selective breeding over countless generations tracing back in antiquity to wild type mallards. It is absurd to ask for breeding records of any of them.
They are all virtually identical genetically given that it is extremely improbable that any two examples of any higher animal will have an exactly identical makeup. I think one would be hard pressed to distinguish the genetic signature of a wild type mallard from that of a similarly marked Indian Runner.
I believe that your problem stems from your inability to fully comprehend the distinction between phenotype and genotype.
Yes Rouens do have very similar colouration and markings to those of the wild type mallard. That similarity is quite superficial.

Its you who clearly lacks the understanding of basic genetics and your one who loves to insult people.

I am happy to discuss this with others but not you any further "doggo".

Weston · **Posted:** Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:06 pm

ColacWaterfowl wrote:

NZWaterfowl wrote:

I am fairly new to rouens with 7 years breeding only but right from the start when purchased from a well established duck breeder I was aware of what the rouens are and that is mallards as the people in the posts above have been saying. I am proud they are mallards and I am perplexed as to why some of you are not. There is no shame in the fact they are mallards and those of us who breed them are proud to call them mallards at least in NZ we are.

"A rose, by any other name, is still a rose"

I hope my first post is ok and not to abrupt

Yes very good first post [smilie=welcome.gif]

to APF How do you find your Mammoth Mallard Rouens for fertility in NZ? Do you have mating issues? Also do you eat them?

The mating and fertility are a big issue with the mammoth mallard rouens a mate of mine has more than most in australia and he has a few ducks with spine issued due to over mating and the weight of drakes. Most of the ducks with that issue he's had to eat as breeding is no longer an option. I will be interesting to know if breeders in New Zealand have the same issues with the mammoth mallard rouens based on the weights there?

Yes [smilie=welcome.gif]

to the biggest and best poultry forum in Australia NZWaterfowl if you have some picts to post that would be good. If you need help with that let me know

fowlslave · **Joined:** Mon Oct 08, 2012 9:42 pm **Posts:** 23

2_Drakes wrote:

Also as a rouen breeder Fowlslave, can you tell us the history of the rouen please. How they were first bred. All the literature I can find says they were overfed mallards that were selectively bred buy choosing the largest of both sexes of mallards no other breed was used. If this is indeed true then they must still be mallards forgetting they are recognized in the poultry standards as rouen. As you know and its been mentioned many breeders in the world do refer to rouens as "giant mallards" including Ashtons Waterfowl.

The term "mammoth" is as by definition "giant"

mam·moth
/ˈmaməTH/Noun

Adjective
Huge: "a mammoth corporation".

Synonyms
huge - enormous - giant - gigantic - colossal - immense

I dont need to recount the history of the rouen here it has already been done to death in this thread.
The point that i am trying to make and what you people are trying to avoid is, that all domestic breeds of duck barring the muscovy are mallard based, is this not correct ?
There fore every breed of domestic duck should also be refered to as being a mallard because no other genus was used to create any of them, is this also not correct?

Weston · **Posted:** Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:53 pm

We ALL well know the history of domesticus and its been discussed in many topics here so we have never avoided it in any way.

fowlslave wrote:

[The point that i am trying to make and what you people are trying to avoid is, that all domestic breeds of duck barring the muscovy are mallard based, is this not correct ?

That is correct and we ALL know that including you

fowlslave wrote:

[There fore every breed of domestic duck should also be refered to as being a mallard because no other genus was used to create any of them, is this also not correct?

This is not correct as over the thousand years there is significant genetic differences and most certainly phenotypical differences as you should know? what you are avoiding is this certainly not the case with mammoth mallard rouens they remain both genotypical and phenotypical mallard regardless of very insignificant differences. If you wish to continue to call the "rouen" thats your choice we on the other hand will call them by the name we believe is correct and supported by the evidence which is Mammoth Mallard Rouens aka giant rouens.

fowlslave · **Joined:** Mon Oct 08, 2012 9:42 pm **Posts:** 23

Ah well Weston, at least we can agree on some aspects of this thread, and that is a healthy progression than657

As you say, i can keep calling my waterfowl "Rouens", and i certainly am comfortable doing that thankyou.
There are still other things we will discuss further i am sure, and i will look forward to doing that with you.

NZWaterfowl · **Joined:** Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:03 am **Posts:** 5

I call them giant mallards or rouens I don't think it matters at all I am happy they are mallards

Yes I do have some troubles with fertility its lower than the standard mallards which is usually 100% I get about 60% with the giants but thankfully as yet no trouble the ducks spin or curved backs like some I have heard of happening. Yes I do eat them when I need to cut down on them and they make a nice meal

Thank you for the welcomes

Weston · **Posted:** Mon Aug 05, 2013 1:25 pm

Thats no much different to here my mates getting around 65% fertility and thats with an incubator. He sells most off for eating as the breed was created for and he's making a little money so he's happy. He said he was pairing the heaviest drake over the lightest duck for best results are you doing similar?

2_Drakes · **Posted:** Mon Aug 05, 2013 4:09 pm

fowlslave wrote:

2_Drakes wrote:

Also as a rouen breeder Fowlslave, can you tell us the history of the rouen please. How they were first bred. All the literature I can find says they were overfed mallards that were selectively bred buy choosing the largest of both sexes of mallards no other breed was used. If this is indeed true then they must still be mallards forgetting they are recognized in the poultry standards as rouen. As you know and its been mentioned many breeders in the world do refer to rouens as "giant mallards" including Ashtons Waterfowl.

The term "mammoth" is as by definition "giant"

mam·moth
/ˈmaməTH/Noun

Adjective
Huge: "a mammoth corporation".

Synonyms
huge - enormous - giant - gigantic - colossal - immense

I dont need to recount the history of the rouen here it has already been done to death in this thread.
The point that i am trying to make and what you people are trying to avoid is, that all domestic breeds of duck barring the muscovy are mallard based, is this not correct ?
There fore every breed of domestic duck should also be refered to as being a mallard because no other genus was used to create any of them, is this also not correct?

Well we all go back to organisms originally but we have come a long way genetically since then, duck included.
It was worth a try, thank anyway.

NZWaterfowl · **Joined:** Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:03 am **Posts:** 5

I do similar Weston yes but for the show I stay with the largest to largest but then they are only for show then eaten after 3 or 4 shows cause they are hopeless breeders

WeipaWaterfowl · **Joined:** Mon May 13, 2013 1:31 pm **Posts:** 3

Its a shame we can't import from NZ it would be interesting to swap mallard rouen blood and see how they breed together

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