AUSTRALIAN POULTRY FORUM™

But what about the Campbells? Aren't they basically the same breed? Weren't Harlequins simply sports off the Khakis? Isn't the only real difference colour, & maybe quality, since Campbells (khaki) are bred in larger numbers by more breeders so more bred allowing for greater selection & finer quality young to go forward with?

Questions, questions

Yes they are a sport from Khaki Campbell but they have a very different personality. I have had Campbell’s in the past and found they are not as social or friendly to humans as Harlequins

A generalisation maybe? Temperment could vary considerably between different strains of both breeds/varieties? Possibly influenced by management practices, selection process, or birds utilised in the "development" of the particular strain/family involved??

Plenty of variables

This is taken from an article I found on feathersite. I've only taken parts of it, the whole lot was a bit too long.

The Welsh Harlequin is not an old breed, developed by Leslie Bonnet around 1949 from a color mutation in a flock of Khaki Campbells. Welsh Harlequins therefore are a "new" and relatively unknown breed.

Campbells, strictly speaking, are maintained for egg production. The Welsh Harlequin is also generally classified as an egg breed, but because of its greater size, it does make a nice three to five pound roaster, not at much meat as a Pekin, but nowhere near as much fat either. Even the earliest literature on the breed indicated egg yields equal to, and in some lines, greater than the Campbell. This depends nearly as much on environment and management as it does on genetics, but Harlequins should yield an annual production of 275-350 white eggs averaging 32 ounces per dozen. The eggs are of excellent quality. Harlequins are noticeably calmer than Campbells. The Welsh Harlequin is very stylish, a winner at exhibitions, a layer of more eggs that you can eat, a producer of lean meat, an excellent setter and mother, and a calm, quiet addition to the farm.

Im not sure you could say they are the same breed as the Campbell after 60 years of being bred in their own right, but I'm sure they still have similar features.

I can't believe they aren't more popular! I think they are certainly prettier than campbells and have amazing egg laying capabilities. I hope one day I can find some to try and contribute to their longevity !!

That is very interesting info Roova, & not having had anything to do with WH' on a personal level, I guess I shouldn't really have commented too much. But I was interested in some of the criteria in your article differentiating the Campbell from the WH though, particularly size. I had based my response on info gleaned from the Aussie Standards & that info actually identifies equal weights, type, feather condition etc etc. Basically the same bird accordingly, but then I guess it all depends on what you read, & the idiosycratic standard requirements of the country involved. My American book (Holderread, 2001, p. 43) states that "In conformation, the Harlequin closely resembles the Campbell".

Yes I agree that 60 years of breeding could well have influenced temperment, & also agree whole-heartedly with your info provided re: the influencing roles of environment & management on individual strains etc. But I also believe that other breeds introduced over the years may well have contributed also to temperment?? In fact, finding birds in this country that can be traced directly back to the original sports without having had any other "blood" introduced would be I expect, extremely difficult. If you do happen to find them then kindly let me know There is also the question as to whether they were initially introduced into this country from abroad, or re-created? I have no idea. In some instances, the name could be sixty years old, but the strain relatively new.

One inconsistency (to my way of thinking) in the above article relating to the "breeds" wonderful laying ability & qualities as an "excellent setter & mother"; I have found it more the norm for the excellent laying breeds/varieties (chooks eg leghorns, Isa Browns etc; ducks eg Campbells, Runners etc) to be less than optimal sitters & mothers because a bird that invests time in hatching & rearing young is not usually as productive as one that doesn't? But of course may be dependent upon strain, introduced blood, environment etc etc.

It may interest you to know that only one "identified" gene for colour seperates the Campbell (Khaki) from the WH. So if you can get hold of just one WH, then you could well develop your own strain through a program of your own, selecting for desirable temperment of course. Otherwise, the Campbell type, according to "our" standards, will be quite suitable for the program.

Edited to add, I think personally that the WH is equally eligible to be viewed as a "breed" in it's own right after 60 years of being so named, otherwise it would more aptly be named something like "Welsh Harlequin Campbell" or "Harlequined Campbell" wouldn't it if just another variety of the Campbell breed proper. But some may argue. My wording above could have been more calculated I suppose eg, aren't they basically the same breed type-wise, laying-wise, weight-wise etc, as specified by the Australian Standard & info available on laying ability.

Cheers

I don't have anything to do with them on a personal level either so am not speaking from experience. I agree, I think it would be very hard to tell if there were any 'purebred' WH in Australia from original lines. Over the last six months I have seen every variation of what someone else says is a Welsh Harlequin - its hard to know what the 'Australian' WH should look like!

I bought these ducklings a couple of weeks ago from Nth Qld, advertised as Welsh Harlequins. Unfortunately I'm only just learning and didn't ask for photos of the parents or at least the breeding pen. Lesson now learnt! The breeder was NOT interested in hearing that I thought he'd sold me crossbreds and insisted they were WH.

http://paforumphotogallery.com/displayi ... ?pos=-4194
(sorry I don't know how to make the photo display automatically).

Im still searching and was sent photos yesterday of WH ducklings for sale and there was a real mixed bunch there too..the parents looked like appleyard cross - eye stripes, yellow legs and beaks and all.

I'm sure there are people out there with the real deal and I'd love to know where they are! There are unfortunately many out there with ducks not really WH (and these breeders certainly aren't helping give them a good name or perpetuate the breed).

I also think that although they are always going to be closely associated/related with the campbells, at some point surely they are no longer campbells?

It would be fantastic to see what the WH owned/bred by the people on this site look like for comparison if anyone has photos they are willing to post?

Cheers Rachel

I have had a similar experience so don't feel bad it’s not your fault, we rely on peoples honesty. It can be hard for use new to all this poultry and we can be a little too trusting on face value

I saw another ad on Farmstock for Welsh Harlequins and out of interest asked for photos. This is what I was sent:
http://paforumphotogallery.com/displayi ... ?pos=-4212

I said to the lady, they are lovely ducks but I don't think they are Welsh Harlequin. She asked me what I thought they should look like so I sent her the following photo including one of the green eggs they lay:
http://paforumphotogallery.com/displayi ... ?pos=-4213

These ducks belong to a lady who is kindly going to sell me eggs next breeding season or if weather permits. (She gave me permission to post the photo). Aren't they gorgeous! They are from an old line and she thinks she has the last 'pure' ones left. They lay a lovely green egg.

This is the response from the original lady who obviously did not agree with me!!

Thank you for your expert information , as I said to you i was interested in a quoiet duck to eat a plague of grass hoppers , they did the job . Following your E.mail I made some internet research into the breed , What I found is that the breed is also called Honey Campbell and can come in Honey colours , they lay WHITE EGGS ,.
Colours is not everything ,I have 2 indian runners that have the perfect colours of WH , the body shape is important also , yours looks to thick in the head and neck to be pure also your eggs are not white ?????the information I found is that WH lay white eggs .....I do agree with you that lots of people may sell sell cross breed poultry , I will in the future question any prospective buyer of the use they want out of their ducks and make sure my ducks are what they want , so they are not desapointed . I do not know how long you have been breeding WH, I am surprise that you were interested in more ducks as they are such prolific layers that they multiply so fast , you must have a fair amount of them.

It seems to pay to say 'thank you but no thankyou' and not give someone feedback because it seems to upset them. This lady was obviously dirty at me for my input!

The colour of those "gorgeous welsh harlequins" looks very very good to me, well, almost exactly the same as in my text at any rate. They are lovely honey coloured ducks.

Best of luck when you get your eggs, bet you can't wait

Cheers

Hi Drayllor

Long time no see! How is your mob going? Any developments in colour with the two dark ducks? Did that light splotch get bigger or just stay the same? The two I have here (from the original four) are in the middle of moulting and look pretty terrible so I'm assuming your two are much the same?

Regarding the eggs I think I'll have a little longer to wait unfortunately. I had a broody mussy ready and waiting for eggs but a dirty great copperhead was eating the WH eggs down south and now its a bit too hot for posting. It feels really good to have found the real deal (I think they are anyway) so I'm more than happy to sit back and wait for the right time.

Nobody seems to want to post photos of their Welsh Harlequin so I feel at a bit of a disadvantage with nothing to compare to, but we'll see.

I hope you have a really great Christmas
Cheers Rachel